MozartForum http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum A discussion site and library about Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart en Thu, 17 May 2012 06:26:58 GMT vBulletin 60 http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/images/misc/rss.jpg MozartForum http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum Haydn in Italy - unjust neglect? http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5039&goto=newpost Wed, 16 May 2012 12:42:18 GMT In another thread Counterpoint recently commented:
For the last few days I've been working my way through listening to the last, great works of Haydn - the last 4 masses, some of the great piano trios and sonatas, "The Creation" and "The Seasons" and, finally, the last 4 symphonies. What a labour of love this is!! I'm preparing a seminar for 24 May and am astounded by this composer who is unjustly neglected these days in favour of Mozart and Beethoven. These are works of the greatest order of magnitude and surely rate as masterpieces. I especially love the Masses and the Piano Sonata No. 62 and the Piano Trio No. 42. Haydn said of the trios, "sonatas for keyboard with cello and violin accompaniment". Oh yes, these are absolutely glorious.

In the preface to his 1998 autobiographical book "Horns in High C" H. C. Robbins Landon, who more than any other individual is responsible for the rediscovery and re-evaluation of Joseph Haydn in the second half of the 20th century, asks "Can we equate Haydn's ratings in Austria, Germany, England, France and Italy? Certainly Haydn means nothing to the average music-loving Italian. Before World War II, Mozart's position would have differed just as widely between Austria and England, or Italy and Germany. In those days Mozart was a cult figure (as compared to Beethoven), but not in Austria and Germany."

So the question arises, where do Mozart lovers, members of this Forum, rate Joseph Haydn, and given the international reach of our membership, is H. C. Robbins Landon's assessment still accurate? ]]> MozartForum Discussion Ron Hunter http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5039 Appoggiaturas in K310 http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5038&goto=newpost Tue, 15 May 2012 23:08:13 GMT Hi. I've been wrestling with the first movement of the A minor Piano Sonata for a couple of months now and, although I can play decently through 70% of it, the remaining 30% looks like it's beyond my reach for now. But none of you can help me with that, so that's beside the point.

The thing I wanted some info on are the appoggiaturas in the beginning. Here's the part of the score I'm interested in:
(Sample-score modified from a score taken from the Neue Mozart-Ausgabe for illustration purposes only.)



In the right hand part of measures 2 and 4, Mozart clearly wrote the A as an appoggiatura to the G# (I highlighted the notes inside a red rectangle). When the analogous part of the first theme returns in measures 10 and 12, he writes the A and G# as 2 quavers instead of appoggiatura + crotchet (highlighted inside a blue rectangle). I imagine that if Mozart took the trouble to make the distinction when he wrote it, this was the way he wanted it to be played?

I couldn't find a high-res image of the autograph, but even in this low-res image, you can see that it's written exactly as in the NMA score:




So, why then, so many (perhaps a majority of) interpreters, instead of playing it like it's written:


...they play it like this:


If they're going to convert all appoggiaturas+crotchet to quavers then why don't they also convert the appoggiatura+crotchet in measure 1 (D# -> E) so it sounds like this (I've never heard it played like this):

It's the same thing.

I've compiled a few performances so you can listen to it played both ways, if you want to:

Played as it's written:
Claudio Arrau: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaVQ3wZK3cE&t=1m52s
Friedrich Gulda: http://youtu.be/MKd1TEfAqoI
Ingrid Haebler: http://youtu.be/fNtKcQV1DYY
Christoph Eschenbach: http://youtu.be/7NC8-Ybkq5w

Played without the appoggiatura, converting it to 2 quavers:
Sviatoslav Richter: http://youtu.be/AswvrITHDTk
Emil Gilels: http://youtu.be/4OjflUdRlWg
Dinu Lipatti: http://youtu.be/OPPbI9xjYuY
Claudio Arrau: http://youtu.be/jt4ryxjfvYQ

As you'll notice, Arrau plays it both ways in different performances. I've also listened to Haebler play it both ways.

I'm not saying the 2nd way is wrong (although I certainly like the 1st way much better); I'd just like to know why so many performers choose to play it like quavers. Is there a historical reason for this practice? Is it mainly a matter of taste of the interpreter? Evidently the 1st way has to be the more correct one, right? Even if it is common practice to interpret appoggiaturas like this, the fact that Mozart made the difference between measures 2&4 and measures 10&12 says to me that it was probably an important detail. An yes, I also know that Mozart improvised a lot so he maybe would have played it differently every time.

I know there are probably many more cases where an appoggiatura is not played like it's written. As I recall, a similar thing happens in virtually all performances of the last movement of the A major Sonata (K331), but I thought in that case it was due to the impracticality of playing a sequence of appoggiaturas in such a rapid fashion (I certainly cannot do it).

Thanks for any info. I don't know if something similar has been discussed before, but I couldn't find it.



I'm also quite interested in knowing: Which of the 2 ways do you prefer?

Regards ]]> MozartForum Discussion dwyane http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5038 Playing Mozart Tomorrow http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5037&goto=newpost Tue, 15 May 2012 22:50:36 GMT It's been a while...

I will be giving a short recital tomorrow. As part of the program I will play a favorite arrangement that I made several years ago of the (1st) MENUETTO from Divertimento No.17, K 334. If any of you might wonder how that sounds on the accordion, I will send an mp3 copy to any MozartForum member just for the asking. All you have to do is to contact me via my website.

Meanwhile, wish me luck! (I'd better start practicing - just kidding.)

All the best,

Zevy
 ]]> MozartForum Discussion Zevy http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5037 What are you listening to? http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5036&goto=newpost Tue, 15 May 2012 22:38:46 GMT Selections from my new recording of "The Magic Flute" with Rene Jacobs. It's just amazing.

Also, (not Mozart related) a birthday present today for my beautiful husband: Liszt Piano Music, played by Leif Ove Andsnes - your virtuosic (eye-candy) pianist from Norway, Bjorn!! As Dire Straits would say, "ooh, the boy can play"! ]]> MozartForum Discussion Counterpoint http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5036 A comical moment in an Opera Seria. http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5035&goto=newpost Sun, 13 May 2012 15:45:43 GMT Mozart must have had a good laughter in the second Act of La Clemenza di Tito when Vitellia prayed to the God of Wedding, Hymen (word derived from the Greek term for membrane in ancient anatomy) to restore her virginity before wedding Tito, (which she lost to Sesto).


"No more
shall Hymen descend
to weave
fair garlands of flowers".

This is my personal interpretation, but I could be wrong. Nevertheless, I couldn't stop laughing while viewing this segment.

Littlesausage. ]]> MozartForum Discussion littlesausage http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5035 K 303 Violin and Piano http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5034&goto=newpost Sun, 13 May 2012 10:05:21 GMT Hi Mozartians,

I need your help: I can't find the Sonata K 303 and I've searched it for a long time but I haven't got any success. I have got all Mozart's Piano and Violin sonotas except this...and I'm courios to know it.
Can you help me?

Thank you beforehand.

Marta ]]> MozartForum Discussion MartaWAM http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5034 Tortures Unabated http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5033&goto=newpost Fri, 11 May 2012 14:14:21 GMT I have known for some time that the big dramatic aria in Abduction, as sung by Konstnze is almost always presented in cut frorm. Perhaps two dozen measures have been cut out, probably because the aira, even without those measures, is difficult enough. However, until recently, I never heard the... I have known for some time that the big dramatic aria in Abduction, as sung by Konstnze is almost always presented in cut frorm. Perhaps two dozen measures have been cut out, probably because the aira, even without those measures, is difficult enough.

However, until recently, I never heard the aria uncut. Now Diana Domrau has release a volume of her singing only Mozart's music, and one of the arias she performs (and magnificently) is the uncut version of "Tortures Unabated" or "Martern aller Arten."

It's quite a show of skill.

Dan Leeson ]]> MozartForum Discussion dnleeson http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5033 Vale Maurice Sendak http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5032&goto=newpost Wed, 09 May 2012 13:48:39 GMT Maurice Sendak died Tuesday, 8th May 2012. http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/09/books/maurice-sendak-childrens-author-dies-at-83.html?_r=1 Mozart was his favourite composer, and he drew him many times, as well as designing sets for the operas. Maurice Sendak died Tuesday, 8th May 2012.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/09/bo...t-83.html?_r=1

Mozart was his favourite composer, and he drew him many times, as well as designing sets for the operas.
Attached Images
 
]]> MozartForum Discussion Ron Hunter http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5032 Improving The Magic Flute http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5031&goto=newpost Tue, 08 May 2012 14:47:59 GMT Hi, I just wondered... if 'The Magic Flute' is such a poor/mediocre libretto, has anyone tried to improve it? All the music could stay the same after all. ]]> MozartForum Discussion jimallanmusic http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5031 Mozart music in a funeral. http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5030&goto=newpost Mon, 07 May 2012 23:29:47 GMT I attended mass for a close member of my family who died last Friday. I was surprised to know that I was given the opportunity to select the music. The options given by the church was the adagio movement of Marcello's oboe concerto and Albinoni's adagio for strings and organ, both wonderful choices. Since I was given the last word, I chose Mozart's Ave Verum Corpus in D K-618 and Laudate Dominum from Mozart Vesperae Solemnes de Confessore K-339. The funeral was held in Vero Beach, Florida.

Rest in Peace my father in law.

Littlesausage. ]]> MozartForum Discussion littlesausage http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5030 The MozartForum is an educational resource http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5029&goto=newpost Mon, 07 May 2012 02:07:13 GMT Are you a High School student or an undergraduate at University struggling with an essay, needing some feedback before you present it formally? Maybe an amateur with a burning interest in a particular aspect of Mozartiana that you are writing an article about? Do you realise how difficult it is... Are you a High School student or an undergraduate at University struggling with an essay, needing some feedback before you present it formally? Maybe an amateur with a burning interest in a particular aspect of Mozartiana that you are writing an article about?

Do you realise how difficult it is to be accepted and published by a scholarly journal? Yet here on the MozartForum you have a ready-made audience of hundreds of people who love his music and are interested in his life. Apart from the enormous resource in the library here, and the countless posts in the archive, the Forum is a place where you can try out your ideas and depend on receiving constructive feedback and advice.

There are many silent members here, people who have never posted. Please don't be shy. This was founded as an educational resource, so please make use of it.

[I'm posting this request following a private discussion with another member who shared these views with me.] ]]> MozartForum Discussion Ron Hunter http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5029 Aria question http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5028&goto=newpost Tue, 01 May 2012 18:47:50 GMT This aria here below I've uploaded myself to YouTube some time ago. It's a part of the Peter Sellars' Cosi Fan Tutte version, and it's as far as I know usually not performed as a part of the Cosi.

Can anyone tell what number it has in the Köchel Verzeichnis (KV; in English only K) and its exact title? Maybe also some info about its relation with the Cosi Fan Tutte? Was it part of the original libreto or added later?

Thanks in advance!

Btw: I find it an excellent and moving aria, very well sung and 'played' here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M0M3WOJwqM ]]> MozartForum Discussion Kees http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5028 Was Don Ottavio mugged? http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5027&goto=newpost Sat, 28 Apr 2012 20:11:26 GMT Matthew Polenzani appeared on the "Opera Quiz" during the intermission to the Met's MANON broadcast a few weeks back. He was asked at one point about his portrayal of Don Ottavio & how he deals with the character's seeming inability to take action against Don Giovanni despite ample justification. Polenzani said that a director for some un-named production of the opera had helped him with that when he mentioned that Giovanni saved Ottavio from bandits "in the play". Polenzani never said which play & I'm wondering just what work this anonymous director was referring to? Juan in the Moliere play saves Elvire's brother, Carlos, from robbers, but that really isn't germane. There's a Don Ottavio in Goldoni's play but I don't recall any scene involving him beset by then saved from robbers. Anyone have a clue? ]]> MozartForum Discussion Didimo Chierico http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5027 The contrapuntal of K-388 http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5026&goto=newpost Sat, 28 Apr 2012 15:14:01 GMT I’ve been reading the technical challenges of performing K-388, an octet for two oboes, 2 clarinets 2 bassoons and 2 horns. I am specifically interested in understanding the Minuet in canone (contrapuntal). The canone calls for a leader(o leaders) to play the melody (theme), followed by another... I’ve been reading the technical challenges of performing K-388, an octet for two oboes, 2 clarinets 2 bassoons and 2 horns. I am specifically interested in understanding the Minuet in canone (contrapuntal).
The canone calls for a leader(o leaders) to play the melody (theme), followed by another player(s) who perform the same melody but in a different key. I am struggling to identify which instruments are the leaders and who are the followers (or does it matter?)
　

http://youtu.be/6VzswPWAE1k

You will notice that this ensamble added a doublebass.

Littlesausage. ]]> MozartForum Discussion littlesausage http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5026 Harpo Marx plays Mozart http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5025&goto=newpost Fri, 27 Apr 2012 05:05:08 GMT Just for a bit of fun I've included this U-Tube link of Harpo Marx playing the music of Mozart (and another!) from one of the films of the Marx Brothers. Harpo, like his brother Chico, was a very talented musician.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gr7QSkVGjrc ]]> MozartForum Discussion Counterpoint http://www.mozartforum.com/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=5025